Playboy Interview: John Wayne

[Q] Playboy: Since you seem bent on setting the record straight, let's discuss the strong criticism you've received about your reputation for being difficult and the obsession you seem to have for taking control of whatever projects you are involved with.

[A] Streisand: OK, but first let's clarify the word control, because it has negative implications. Let's just say when I use the word control, I mean artistic responsibility. If you mean that I am completely dedicated and care deeply about carrying out a total vision of a project-- yes, that's true. I'm interested in all aspects of my work, down to the copy on the radio commercials. It all fascinates me.

[Q] Playboy: We'll ask the question in a blunter way: Why do you think you have a reputation as a bitch?

[A] Streisand: It's a very male-chauvinist word, bitch. I resent it deeply. It's an unkind, mean word. It implies uncalled-for anger. A person who's bitchy would seem to be mean for no reason. I am not a mean person. I don't like meanness in anyone around (concluded on page 273)Streisand(continued from page 205) me. Maybe I'm rude without being aware of it-- that's possible.

[Q] Playboy: So why do you suppose you have that reputation? Why are so many people saying those kinds of things about you?

[A] Streisand: I think it makes good copy. Bad news sells more magazines and newspapers, and the public sees what the editor wants it to see. The New York Times did three separate stories on me that were all favorable. They were never printed. I was told they were too nice-- not spicy enough-- puff pieces. Bad press also acts as an equalizer: "She's got fame and fortune, God forbid she should be nice, too."

[Q] Playboy: Why do critics seem to write about you so emotionally?

[A] Streisand: I don't know. Your guess is as good as mine. I don't have time to worry about those things. Maybe it's because I'm not easily accessible. Maybe it's because they're prejudiced against ex-hairdressers. But with all the important things going on in the world, who really cares? In the final analysis, what I can't understand is, why don't we nurture our artists? Protect them? Support them? Encourage them? Why is it necessary to be so vicious?

[Q] Playboy: Which is easier for you, singing or acting?

[A] Streisand: Singing is easier. A song is only three minutes long. If you have a good voice, a good instrument, you're halfway home. Three quarters of the way home. Acting is indefinable. It's different. It's also less impressive, unless you have a crying scene or a very dramatic moment. When you sing a song, the sheer musicality of the experience can move people; they don't even have to hear the lyric.

[Q] Playboy: Do you listen to your own albums?

[A] Streisand: Never, ever, ever. And don't play one around me.

[Q] Playboy: Really? Why?

[A] Streisand: I can't stand to hear them.

[Q] Playboy: Why?

[A] Streisand: Because I put so much into them when I'm making them: the choice of songs, working on the arrangements, the cover, the copy, the editing. It's like cooking a meal: You don't want to eat it afterward.

[Q] Playboy: What about when friends are over and they say, "Come on, Barbra, sing People ..."?

[A] Streisand: I'm totally embarrassed and shy about singing in front of people. To sing in a room where my friends are-- I'll tell you what happens: I feel them listening so hard, I feel my power, and it frightens me. Somehow, in a big place, when the lights are on you and it's total blackness out there, you're singing alone, it seems like it's the place to do it, to do the thing I do. But I no more could sing a song in a room with my friends than jump off a bridge.

[Q] Playboy: Is it difficult singing for Presidents, as you did for Kennedy and Johnson?

[A] Streisand: I sang for Kennedy because I loved him. I remember meeting him-- it was so incredible; he actually glowed! But when I sang at Johnson's Inauguration, it was the most depressing evening I ever had. Kennedy was dead and this man was there and it was just awful.

[Q] Playboy: What is it, do you think, that makes your voice so special?

[A] Streisand: My deviated septum. If I ever had my nose fixed, it would ruin my career.

[Q] Playboy: Did you ever consider having it fixed?

[A] Streisand: In my earlier periods, when I would have liked to look like Catherine Deneuve, I considered having my nose fixed. But I didn't trust anyone enough to fix it. If I could do it myself with a mirror, I would straighten my nose and take off that little piece of cartilage from the tip.... See, I wouldn't do it conventionally.

[Q] Playboy: A lot of plastic surgeons must have resented your rise to fame.

[A] Streisand: Yeah, made business bad.

[Q] Playboy: Are you temperamental?

[A] Streisand: You would be amazed. [Laughs] If you're talking about truly talented people, usually there is no false temperament. Tension is high on sets. You're priming your inner life to be reviewed in front of this camera. All sorts of things are happening-- people are yelling, laughing, grips upstairs are just idly reading a newspaper, the lights keep burning out, somebody has to go to the bathroom-- while you're, like, in gear. You're very easily set off. You're an emotional charge. Whether you believe it or not, I am not a temperamental person. I constantly am around people who are temperamental-- that means they get crazy for the moment, they're going to walk off, and then they calm down and come back. I never do that, I never walk off. I keep my calm. I don't operate that way, with temperament.

[Q] Playboy: In A Star Is Born, you seemed to be defining aggression in the sense that feminists have been using it. Are you, in fact, a feminist?

[A] Streisand: It's funny. I never thought about the women's movement while I was moving as a woman. I didn't even realize that I was fighting this battle all the time. I just took it very personally; I didn't even separate it from the fact that I was a woman having a hard time in a male society. Then they started to burn the bras and I thought it was ridiculous, although I now understand it in the whole picture of revolution-- one has to go to these crazy extremes to come back to the middle. Actually, I believe women are superior to men. I don't even think we're equal.

[A] But what interested me most about A Star Is Born was the woman issue. In the old version, the characters never fought or disagreed; the female character was willing to give up her career for her man; she used his name at the end. I wouldn't do that. I don't think women should do that. I was interested in being more sexually aggressive in this film-- a different character than I've ever played before. I wanted to portray her as taking what she wants, something that's a big thing for women today, especially sexually. So many women you hear about never have orgasms. It's a matter of taking for your own pleasure. In our first love scene in Star, I wanted to be a sort of Clint Eastwood-- you know, the guy always takes his belt off. That's why I have her being on top. Why should a man always be the one shown opening his pants?

[Q] Playboy: What's your definition of the word fame?

[A] Streisand: Not being left alone.

[Q] Playboy: Sounds like you might have had nightmares about the public and its perception of Barbra Streisand.

[A] Streisand: Oh, yeah. My biggest nightmare is that I'm driving alone in a car and I get sick and have to go to the hospital. I'd say, "Please, help me," and the people would say, "Hey, you look like...." And I'm dying while they're talking and wondering whether I'm Barbra Streisand.

[Q] Playboy: Does aging bother you?

[A] Streisand: No. I mean, I don't like the idea of having a big double chin or anything, but I don't care about lines, wrinkles or playing the parts. I want to be able to control my body-- that's my goal-- so it doesn't control me.

[Q] Playboy: When does your body control you?

[A] Streisand: When I get really frightened, I literally pee in my pants.

[Q] Playboy: Does that still happen?

[A] Streisand: Yeah. The last time it happened was when I got caught in Customs. I didn't report a pair of boots I'd bought, and the guy went through my purse and found the slip for the boots. I couldn't believe it. I was dumb enough to have the receipt in my bag and he found it and said, "What's this?" I peed in my pants.

[Q] Playboy: How old were you?

[A] Streisand: How old was I? It was last year, what are you talking about? By the way, I claim everything now, even a pack of Japanese gum.

[Q] Playboy: How would you summarize the Barbra Streisand behind all the conflicting images?

[A] Streisand: I am very flawed, very imperfect. I am my own worst critic. I put far more demands on myself than I do on anyone else. As strong as my will can be at times, I can be easily swayed by the last person I talk to. I operate on instinct, and when my instinct says go, I go like a horse with blinders on, like a Taurus bull who sees red. But I can also be as wishy-washy as the next guy. When my vision's not clear about something, I can be queen of the definite maybe. I am a mass of contradictions. I am constantly changing, so that by the time this interview appears, I shall be in a different place.

--October 1977, interviewed by Lawrence Grobel