Playboy Interview: Bob Giraldi

Bob Giraldi may be the busiest film maker in America. He's considered the Cecil B. De Mille of music videos, the Steven Spielberg of television commercials. Having worked with Michael Jackson on the now-classic, award-winning "Beat It" video, he is credited with setting the standard for that medium. Consequently, such heavyweights as Paul McCartney, Lionel Richie, Diana Ross, Kenny Rogers and Pat Benatar have sought him out for their own videos. As for TV commercials, Giraldi could easily be the highest-paid director in the business, if not the most visible. In addition to making the infamous Pepsi spot in which Jackson's hair caught fire, he has directed the majority of the hilarious Lite Beer All-Star ads for Miller, a campaign that has been recognized as the most successful in history. Bill Zehme caught up with Giraldi in New York. He reports: "I asked Giraldi if he'd like to take the Pepsi Challenge. He said he'd rather not, though he swears he'd pass--he just hates that ad campaign. During our conversations, he drank ice water, took a call from Olivia Newton-John, looked at rushes of a Jermaine Jackson video and made fun of dancing lesbians."

1.

[Q] Playboy: Do real men watch rock videos?

[A] Giraldi: Interesting. The other night, I was sitting in my apartment in Los Angeles with three friends, all guys, all real men. We were each on our tenth glass of wine, watching MTV. We were heckling the screen, saying, "What the hell is this shit?" But we found ourselves waiting for the next one, glued with a sort of excited expectation. One guy had an appointment, but it took him an hour and a half to drag himself away from the television set. Another guy was like a kid who memorizes batting averages; he knew the names of every one of those fucking groups: Crush, Fear, Up Your Nose, The Talking Glasses, The Ashtrays. The whole thing was like watching sports. I had never found myself doing that before, but I was with guys. Now, maybe truck drivers and macho muscle men get uptight seeing sissies dancing and prancing around in videos. But my feeling is that 90 percent of that population are flaming faggots, anyway.

2.

[Q] Playboy: Settle a raging debate for us. Are videos advertising or art?

[A] Giraldi: I say art. Cynical businessmen and record executives call me naive. But I know advertising and have been in that business all my life. Videos are, perhaps, a promotional tool to bring the music industry back to life. But are they ads? They may help sell records, but so does the weather. Videos don't sell songs the way Bubba Smith sells Lite Beer for Miller. There's no pitch involved. When you see a great video, you're more interested in watching, hearing and feeling it than you are in running out to buy the record. Videos are created through inspiration, much like paintings or movies. That goes for the very best videos, anyway. The majority of them are just boring and repetitive. Those are the ones that are most like advertising, simply because they all look the same. I've had enough of selling. When I feel the urge to sell, I make a Pepsi-Cola commercial.

3.

[Q] Playboy: What is MTV's most unforgivable sin?

[A] Giraldi: Saturation. Nobody could have predicted this video craze, but we owe it to ourselves to be careful. Videos may wear out their welcome. I like MTV and believe it's the single most responsible entity behind the boom in the music industry. But even my 17-year-old daughter, Maria, tells me she can't watch a steady diet of MTV anymore, whereas she enjoys shows like NBC's Friday Night Videos and New York Hot Tracks. For me, it's like football, in the sense that at the end of every single winter season, there's been too much.

4.

[Q] Playboy: Where would you rather watch MTV?

[A] Giraldi: Thirty-five thousand feet above the ground, in an airplane. That would be a smart place to pipe in a channel. You're a captive audience up there. When you're bored on one of those six-or eight-hour flights to Europe or California, you might like some jive to break things up. You know, the plane would rock a little bit in the sky. The worst place to watch it is in bed, making love. The beat is so varied, you might lose your place.

5.

[Q] Playboy: A number of big-name acts--Joe Jackson, for one--have denounced videos for robbing people of their right to visualize music for themselves. How valid is that argument?

[A] Giraldi: Not valid at all. Joe Jackson thinks videos suck for several reasons. However, he has also said that if he could dance like Michael Jackson, he might not mind doing videos. What he's saying, in his heart, is he feels he may not be a consummate performer. I disagree. I'd love to make a video with Joe Jackson, because I'd make him as hot as a firecracker onscreen. Moreover, he underestimates the power of music.

Example: Lionel Richie's classic love song Hello. We made a video in which Lionel is a teacher to a blind girl who's in love with him. She sculpts an identical likeness of his face in clay. Admittedly, the video is somewhat contrived--purposefully, in fact--but it's a nice visual love experience. It's my personal concept of the song. When I told Lionel about it at dinner one night, he damn near cried. He said it had nothing to do with the song, but he loved it. When you hear that song on your car radio, I guarantee that you will not think about the video. If we're as romantic a people as I think we are, songs will never leave our imaginations. Music is stronger than that.

6.

[Q] Playboy: Now that Michael Jackson's Beat It has become the video classic, can you reveal the seamy underbelly of its creation?

[A] Giraldi: Beat It is a study in timing. Young people in America were ready to see videos that were more professional, more story-oriented, more emotional. They were ready to see a star actually perform. Interestingly enough, if Beat It premiered tomorrow, it wouldn't be the phenomenon it was then, even though it will always be a fine video.

The real scoop on Beat It, if anyone cares, is that Michael and I wanted to do a street interpretation from the start. Other interpretations have been mentioned by sicker minds. But that's what the song is about: turning your cheek to the dangers and the silliness of young street violence. Michael suggested that we use real Los Angeles gang members and break dancers. I took the idea on vacation to Santo Domingo with my wife and daughter. For the entire week, I sat on the beach, playing Beat It, and wrote a scenario based on experiences I had growing up in Paterson, New Jersey. It was chic to be tough. I hated that, obviously because I wasn't tough. To this day, I have no tolerance for bullies. I go right after them on the sets.

That knife-fight sequence comes from a story a Puerto Rican guy in the Bronx told me 20 years (continued on page 153) Bob Giraldi (continued from page 107) ago. One night, he and his gang from Tremont Avenue had a fight with a rival gang. They dug a circular pit, and the two gang leaders climbed in, tied their free hands together and proceeded to cut each other up with the knives in their other hands. One of them was killed. That image just stuck with me. Choreographer Michael Peters turned it into a beautiful dance. That's showbiz.

7.

[Q] Playboy: No one has ever heard your side of the story regarding the ill-fated Pepsi commercial in which Michael's hair caught fire. You were directing. What went through your mind?

[A] Giraldi: Nothing. I was the only one who didn't really know what was happening until people rushed onto the stage. I didn't see it. I was off to the side, watching my black-and-white monitor. The fire looked like a special lighting effect on my screen. Suddenly, Michael was trying desperately to get his jacket off, thinking it was on fire. Like most accidents, it was over before it started. But the hysteria was there. He never seemed to be in danger. Then he was whisked off to the hospital and I saw him a couple of hours later. He was speaking despite the pain. It was an accident. To say any more about it is not very smart, because there will probably be a lawsuit.

I have no bad feelings toward Michael, and I hope he doesn't harbor any toward me. He is a brilliant performer, a genuine, shy, withdrawn young man. He and I worked together three times; we did fine work, had fun and made history. But our personal relationship is over--for the moment. He's gone on to do some very important stuff, and so have I.

8.

[Q] Playboy: On the lighter side, The Glove has launched many rumors. Care to add some?

[A] Giraldi: After a couple of days of shooting on the Pepsi commercial, Michael and his brothers were in my dressing room clowning around. We had just been called to the set. I said, "OK, guys, let's go." Michael asked us to wait a minute, because he had to go to the bathroom. So he goes into the John. A few seconds later, from behind the door, we hear him scream, "Aaaaiiiieeeee!" Our hearts sank and we all ran to the bathroom. Michael comes walking out, holding between his fingers his classic jeweled glove, drenched. What had happened was that the glove somehow fell into the toilet. He had fished it out and was laughing. The little glove looked so soppy--I was never quite sure from what.

9.

[Q] Playboy: What's your dream assignment?

[A] Giraldi: Making A Day in the Life, by the Beatles. I won't say how I'd do it. But I told Paul McCartney, for whom I directed the Say Say Say video, that if he ever wants to do that one for posterity, for the sake of history, to let me know. It's obviously one of the songs that make me nuts. But Paul has probably had his share of posterity.

10.

[Q] Playboy: Would you let your daughter marry a rock star?

[A] Giraldi: It depends. I'd love her to marry Boy George. He would be the best catch of the year. I imagine living with him would be great fun. My daughter could pretty-much do what she liked. As it is, she probably will marry a rock star. Her boyfriend is a geologist.

11.

[Q] Playboy: What's the strangest video you never made?

[A] Giraldi: Luciano Pavarotti expressed a desire to make videos of two of his classic songs. I've actually always wanted to work with him. He's certainly a commercial artist--he plays Vegas and football, stadiums. He gives the world gorgeous music. I never met Pavarotti, but I sat down with his manager and all he talked about was the bottom line. It was such a turnoff. He said, "We can't spend that, because the record's going to sell only a million. We'll never get a return." I told him, "First, you're talking to the wrong person. And second, you're doing Pavarotti a disservice." You don't just do videos when the profits from your record sales allow you to. Lionel Richie never said he was afraid to spend money, and his videos helped catapult him to become the most important superstar in the business after Michael Jackson. It's naïve and shortsighted for managers, agents and record companies to take that attitude. The bottom line is a long-range thing in communications and the media.

12.

[Q] Playboy: What would a Frank Sinatra video by Giraldi look like?

[A] Giraldi: It might be tough for Frank now. His place is secure in history. But he's gotten past the age of running around and performing. He's no longer Maggio in From Here to Eternity. A Sinatra video today might simply be his singing face interspersed with other images. The song I'd pick would be Lonely Town. When I graduated from college and got my first job, as an art director in Detroit, I played that song every night for a dozen months. I'm a romantic.

13.

[Q] Playboy: You once wanted to make a feature film about the life of Frank Sinatra, Jr. Why?

[A] Giraldi: My vision was a tragic story that probably would have ended happily: The father is perhaps the greatest pop singer in the history of the world, a cult figure, a strong inspiration to men. The boy, who would never be able to follow in those footsteps, tries anyway. He embarks on an impossible career. He rises, falls, levels off, winds up doing obscure club dates in Minnesota or wherever. He encounters tragedies surrounding the family: his childhood kidnaping; coping with the women in his father's life; finally, the realization that he can't be who he thinks he should be. The message: We can only be ourselves. The young boy grows up and comes to terms with this horrible, tough life. [Pauses] They stopped me. The old man would never allow it. But I didn't want to do an expose or an exploitative movie. A similarly incredible film was made about Jake LaMotta--Raging Bull. But that was a negative piece. I would have made a positive statement. Hollywood would have hated it. But Hollywood doesn't know anything about making movies.

14.

[Q] Playboy: On the sets of the Miller Lite commercials, who gets more respect--you or Rodney Dangerfield?

[A] Giraldi: Rodney gets all the respect in the world from everybody. He always runs around making people crazy. I once said that I'd never seen a more insecure actor, which I still honestly believe. He got very angry at that and accosted me. But the fact is, he constantly tugs at his tie and asks how he looks. Well, he obviously looks terrific. His stuff is incredible. He's a great addition to the All-Stars and a perfect catalyst. But he doesn't hang out. Rodney is not one of the guys. He doesn't sit around a bar with Billy Martin and drink away the evening. But his nervous energy is contagious. No matter what anyone says about Rodney, everybody performs better when he's around.

15.

[Q] Playboy: How does a man who regularly berates such monsters as Bubba Smith and Boog Powell to their faces live to tell the tale?

[A] Giraldi: You mean me? Because they trust me. I've done good by them. They know I feel for all of them genuinely and like them. They're the biggest kids in the world. I call our set the Zoo. I don't demean them. What I do is holler at them, but in my own lovable way.

I'll never forget standing over them on a Fort Lauderdale beach where we were doing the Lite tug-of-war commercial. It was the end of the day. Their hands were red and ripped and bleeding. The sun was beating down. They looked like lobsters, and they were tired of pulling. I just needed one great take, but they weren't giving it to me. I started screaming, "Why, you bunch of has-beens! What the hell's the matter with you? Maybe your careers are all over, but mine's just starting! For Christ's sake, pull, you bastards!" Then I looked into the eyes of Ray Nitschke on one end and Nick Buoniconti on the other, and I realized that, if they wanted to, they could see to it that the world never heard from me again. But they decided instead to pull just a little harder. And that time, it worked. They sensed that I was only after a great shot. Somebody's got to be the coach. These guys are athletes.

16.

[Q] Playboy: America wants to know: Who is that giggly blonde in those commercials? Is she everything you expected in a woman or less?

[A] Giraldi: Her name is Lee Meredith and she is a New Jersey housewife. She's a very fine actress and a very, very bright lady. That ditz character is all fake. In the spots, I guess she's Mickey Spillane's bimbo. The Doll. The guys are always after her on the set, making jokes about her bust and fanny. I can't repeat what they say or else they'll really kill me. Martin is after her every three seconds. But she is a highly respected member of that team.

17.

[Q] Playboy: Tell us some Zoo stories. Which All-Stars cut up? Which don't get it?

[A] Giraldi: Everybody's fun behind the scenes. It's one prank after another. Bubba Smith: I made him tear open a beer can 60 times in his first commercial. He couldn't get the lines. Today it would be nothing for him, because he's turned out to be one of the best performers of all. Great at underplayed comedy. Bob Uecker: funniest man in the world. He likes to walk around the set with my little eyepiece and play director. He gives camera guys and prop men orders like "Danny, shoot her at five-eleven or nine-two!" He doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. Screws them all up. Billy Martin: classy. A joke-ster capable of putting lighted matches in shoe soles. That's his thing. Dick Butkus: takes his work very seriously. Yet he's one of the biggest kids of all. A great instigator, along with Red Auerbach and Tommy Heinsohn. They love to start trouble between people and break balls. They like getting Rodney pissed off. Marv Throneberry: quietest guy of all. But he's not dizzy. All he ever says--on--or offcamera--is "I don't know why they asked me to do this commercial."

18.

[Q] Playboy: Let's ponder the influence of advertising on modern life. If it can't be said in 30 seconds, is it still worth saying?

[A] Giraldi: I don't want to agree with that at all. Unfortunately, the world does. Advertising has created a population that bores quickly, and we're more visually oriented. I read recently that you can see about 175 cuts in a five-minute video, whereas a half-hour episode of I Love Lucy had maybe 12 scenes at most. We have become the Show-Me Generation.

Everybody wants an answer quickly. If a guy calls to sell you insurance, he's got to talk fast before you hang up. You've got to get your word in edgewise or else I'm not gonna listen to it. It's rare for somebody to just sit down and say deliberately, "Now, Bob, look at me and listen." I'll doze off. We've become the fastest country in the world--even in our lovemaking. One has only to go to Europe to realize how fast we are. If we don't get our check in a restaurant sooner than a minute after we're finished eating, we become incensed. We think the waiter has gone off to have a smoke. We are impatient people, because of the incredible deluge of advertising.

9.

[Q] Playboy: If you're someday asked to appear in a commercial, what product would you feel most comfortable selling?

[A] Giraldi: The American Express card. Can't you see it? "Do you know me? I'm the guy who helped Michael Jackson beat it. . . ."

20.

[Q] Playboy: What should you never say to an ex-athlete?

[A] Giraldi: Number one: Never say, "You're old." Athletes have the same egos and insecurities as movie stars. Number two and maybe more important: Never tell him that he can't go to his left anymore. That's the lowest.

"Luciano Pavarotti expressed a desire to make videos. I've always wanted to work with him."