20 Questions: Tom Snyder

Tom Snyder is back. Yes, sir! The veteran broadcaster, best known for hosting NBC's "Tomorrow" show from 1973 to 1982, has brought his unique conversational style, idiosyncratic observations and singular hairstyle to CBS, where his "Late, Late Show With Tom Snyder" debuted in December, after "The Late Show With David Letterman." Letterman's company, Worldwide Pants, is producing. Until Letterman beckoned, the 58-year-old Snyder was comfortably ensconced at cable's CNBC, doing one hour of talk a night, largely free from worries about ratings and pushy network executives. Before that he spent six years doing a national radio show for ABC. Many thought that CBS would bring in a younger person to counter NBC's Conan O'Brien. But the strength of Letterman's insistence persuaded Snyder to give it a try. Contributing Editor David Rensin met with Snyder at the CNBC studios as his stint on cable wound down. Says Rensin, "During our talk, Tom let slip that he hates Q&As and that great stories are the stuff of compelling conversation. Even if he wasn't trying to tell me something, I knew better than not to take my cue from the master."

1.

Playboy: What do you know about late night that your competitor Conan O'Brien is still years away from understanding?

Snyder: How to run a television program. I don't dislike Conan. I've interviewed him twice on my program and I plan to go on his show--I have promised him that I will. But there is a knack to doing this, kid--in knowing how to keep it moving, keep it interesting. I certainly don't do it perfectly every night, but I'm right more than I'm wrong because of my gut. It takes a while to learn, and he's been doing it for only a year. I did my first television talk show in Philadelphia in 1966 or 1967. I fumbled my way; we all do. But the difference is that I fumbled on channel three in Philadelphia, not on the NBC television network. David Letterman fumbled his way in Indianapolis; Johnny Carson on KNXT in Los Angeles. Conan O'Brien will get better, if they give him a chance.

2.

[Q] Playboy: Back in 1993 you appeared on The Larry Sanders Show in an episode in which Sanders hires you to follow his talk show after getting Letterman--who was also a guest--to admit that he was thinking of hiring you to follow his show. Did you know then what we know now, or was it all just coincidence?

[A] Snyder: I was on vacation in San Francisco and somebody called me from The Larry Sanders Show asking if I would consider being on it. Then they sent me the script, and I thought, This is really funny. So I said, "Sure." After I did the show, I thought nothing more about it. I was under contract to CNBC and Dave was still at NBC, though everyone knew he was going to CBS. Then one day, after Dave had gone to CBS, I read in the New York Daily News about my being considered for the spot following his. My reaction was, This is absolutely and truly a joke, meaning I was totally amazed. [Pauses] May I tell you something, my friend? If I had set out, after appearing on the Sanders show, to mount a full-bore campaign to host The Late, Late Show following David Letterman--when that idea was implanted in people's minds through comedy, through art, not reality--do you know what chance I would have had of getting that done? Zero. You can't want for this to happen and make it happen. This was written on the wind. This just came out of nowhere. Actually, it came out of David Letter-man's mind and his loyalty. David's always been very generous to me. He and producers Robert Morton and Peter Lassally just kept saying, "We really think Snyder's the guy."

3.

[Q] Playboy: Are you?

[A] Snyder: Absolutely. It makes so much sense. Having a young comedian on at 12:30 A.M. is already being done by one network. NBC now has three comedians on late at night. I don't think that's what a late-night schedule should be. Traditionally, 11:30 P.M. is a comedy spot. But again at 12:30? No. That's a special time. Plus, I'll be on live. I can take phone calls. We're going to try to simulcast on radio. I'll be able to react to the news of the moment. I can interview entertainers, but if something happens that requires me to interview the president or a foreign dignitary, or the head of an airline, or the commissioner of baseball, I can do that, too. I can do more than just tell jokes.

4.

[Q] Playboy: Letterman inherited your office at NBC. Did you leave anything behind that you wish he'd send you?

[A] Snyder: I'll tell you a funny story. On the office bathroom mirror I wrote in marker pen: "Dear David: Unto thine hands..." and then I departed. The only other things that I left were the drapes. About three years ago he sent them to me. Totally out of the blue, these boxes arrived at ABC Radio. Huge boxes of used drapes that were sun-streaked and faded and frayed. Included was a note handwritten on his stationery: "Dear Tom: You forgot your drapes. Love, Dave." For a while I planned to take them back to New York and hang them in his office when he was away. But it got to be too much of an issue, so I just threw the damn things away.

5.

[Q] Playboy: Letterman once got embarrassed when Kathie Lee Gifford described putting cool cabbage leaves on her breasts to soothe them because they were swollen from nursing. What was your most embarrassing moment on the air?

[A] Snyder: Oh, there have been so many. [Laughs] I was interviewing a man named Meat Loaf one night--the great singer, who has just had a wonderful comeback. For 15 minutes I called this guy "Meatball," and he never said a word. Somebody came out during a break and said to me, "The guy's name is Meat Loaf." He was such a gentleman--he wouldn't correct me on the air.

The night Kathie Lee said that, Dave delivered possibly the greatest line he has ever had at CBS. She said she put the cabbage leaves on her breasts because they were swollen and she couldn't fit into the gown she had planned to wear on the Miss America show. Later she said, "You know, I think I'm swelling up again." And Letterman said, "Could we send out for an emergency Caesar salad?"

6.

[Q] Playboy: Once and for all, are talk shows host- or guest-driven?

[A] Snyder: Host-driven. We tune in to see Jay and Dave. And believe me, they tune in to see Tom and Conan. It doesn't make any difference who the guests are if the host knows what to do with them. Another critical factor is this: The viewers like watching real people who have lives and who speak to them about those lives. Letterman is a real guy. We know he gets stopped for speeding. We know he likes to smoke a cigar during the breaks. Hey, we had fun watching his mom over there at the Olympics. Dave's a member of our family. I talk about my mom, I talk about my kid. I talk about stuff that steams me. I talk about movies I've seen, loves I've lost. One night I even talked about going to the dentist.

7.

[Q] Playboy: Everyone knows about Dan Aykroyd's impersonation of you. How self-conscious did it make you feel?

[A] Snyder: It was more of a caricature. Dan Aykroyd overemphasized certain things: my laugh, the cigarette, the hair. I enjoyed it a great deal. The only time it ever got in the way was when people who hadn't met me expected me to be like the caricature, and I wasn't. Now, of course, it's the joke that won't die. They rerun the damn show on all the cable systems, so that joke is still going. And I guess people are still laughing at it, come to think of it. [Pauses] The caricature that did bother me was Joe Piscopo's. It was meanspirited. He portrayed me as a failed broadcaster living in a run-down hotel in New York City, with a bottle of vodka in my hand, interviewing the staff of the hotel as guests. That hurt me. I felt it was unfair. I mean, what am I, the first guy in the world to have a show canceled? Come on!

8.

[Q] Playboy: In the Seventies you hosted The National Love, Sex and Marriage Test and The National Disaster Survival Test. What test do we need for the Nineties? Snyder: The National Reality Break Test. Folks, do you really think an asteroid is going to hit the earth and kill us all? Do you really think that if you walk every day and don't smoke and don't eat meat and take your vitamins and go to holistic health centers, that you're going to live forever? Do you really think you're going to beat it? Do you really believe them when they say, "Well, we could have saved 4000 lives last year"? Because, folks, with one possible exception since the beginning of time, we haven't saved one life. The reality is that we're all going to leave here someday. There was a series in the Los Angeles Times on how every day we get new information about something that is going to hurt us. Cellular phones are going to kill us. Caffeine is bad for pregnant women. Left-handed people have more heart attacks than right-handed people. The American people are being scared to death, and they don't enjoy themselves anymore. For years we were told that butter was bad and margarine was great. Now margarine is even worse than butter! They are taking every joy, every pleasure, every contentment away from people with this constant research into stuff that nobody thinks about until research is begun on it.

9.

[Q] Playboy: You still smoke an occasional cigar off camera, but to what extent has the loss of the cigarette prop on the air affected you?

[A] Snyder: I never thought about it until you mentioned it. I stopped smoking on all shows because it's no longer appropriate. It also helps that there's no place you can smoke anymore. You can't smoke in this building, you can't smoke in restaurants, you can't smoke on airplanes. I wouldn't go to somebody's house and light up a cigar or a pipe or a cigarette.

10.

[Q] Playboy: Can you tell us what's better than a great conversation?

[A] Snyder: A great meal. It's very simple: some kind of pasta with olive oil, garlic and basil, some broccoli and grilled chicken and maybe a little smoked mozzarella and some capers. It's preceded by a Caesar salad with many anchovies. I love anchovies.

11.

[Q] Playboy: What's your guilty TV-viewing pleasure?

[A] Snyder: Jeopardy and Wheel of Fortune. Wheel of Fortune is dumb and stupid, and it doesn't require a lot of savvy. But I like to watch. I like to beat the contestants to the answer. It makes me happy. The other thing I cannot turn off is Ron Popeil selling anything. I must watch. I don't care if it's the pasta maker, the food dehydrator or the Pocket Fisherman. I'm captivated by this guy. Absolutely enthralled by him. One night, so help me God, I was home, it was late, I got into the vodka a little bit--you know, nothing critical. He had the pasta makers going and he put on the red clam sauce, and I was reaching for the phone! I love it when he looks at the camera and says, "For those of you who can't get enough beef jerky." Have you ever smelled beef jerky? Man, they must be hungry out there! The other one I love is the haircutter that hooks up to the vacuum cleaner.

12.

[Q] Playboy: When you go to the supermarket, which aisle do you visit first?

[A] Snyder: I go to where the air fresheners are. Don't ask me why, but I have a terrible fear of not having enough air freshener in my house. I must have at least 12 cans, and it must be Arm & Hammer Deodorizing Air Freshener, in the yellow can. I'm meticulous about this. Why? I really don't know. I don't do any odd cooking. The house doesn't smell bad, though sometimes, with the gas stove, there's a little gas odor. It's just nice to have air freshener in the house. I have a can in each bathroom and the rest in the cupboard. I also have a lot of paper products: paper towels, bathroom tissue, Kleenex. I don't want to run out of any of this stuff. And I have a lot of light bulbs. I figure they're just as good on my shelf as at the hardware store. When a bulb goes out, I replace it immediately.

13.

[Q] Playboy: What scares you?

[A] Snyder: I'm terrified of airplanes. I have to fly, but you give up so much control. You truly place your life in the hands of another human being. It's a stupid fear, but I have a vivid imagination. And too many times I've done news stories about plane crashes. So I know what can happen. Remember, about 15 years ago, there was a plane flying from the East Coast to Detroit that did a barrel roll somewhere over Michigan? It went into a steep power dive and the pilot prepared everybody for impact. At the last second he lowered the landing gear, and that created sufficient drag to slow it down. He got control and landed in Detroit, and, thank God, nobody got hurt. I interviewed one of the passengers. I said, "What caught your attention most?" He said, "Let me tell you: I was so angry." I said, "Why?" He replied, "We're coming in for the landing approach, and the pilot tells us to prepare for impact. I look out and as we're coming over the runway, there's no foam on the runway. In every account I've heard of an aircraft making an emergency landing, they put foam on the runway. And I thought, How come I don't have my foam? Why didn't they foam my runway? I paid full fare. I want my foam!" What an amazing (continued on page 181)Tom Snyder(continued from page 128) story! Didn't think about being scared. He wanted his foam.

"I'm clearly a night person. I was offered a job doing national radio during the day. I turned it down."

14.

[Q] Playboy: Speaking of scary, would you interview Charles Manson today?

[A] Snyder: Probably not. We took a lot of flak for that. And let's face it: It was a naked grab for ratings. It was also an effort to take a look at a man who had been profiled in book and in motion picture. But, looking back on it, he is such a lunatic. I question whether we learned any more about Manson from having done that. Still, at the time, it was compelling television. And the great thing is that since then, Geraldo Rivera and Diane Sawyer have interviewed Manson--not that that in any way gives the imprimatur to us for having done it--so at least I can say to people who ask about Manson, "Ask Diane or Geraldo. They've spoken with him more recently."

15.

[Q] Playboy: When did you finally realize that the Tomorrow show was over?

[A] Snyder: I was in the studio and Wendy O. Williams and the Plasmatics came in and blew up a car. I thought to myself, It's over. This is not what I do.

16.

[Q] Playboy: As a once and future king of late night, describe the philosophical difference between morning people and night people. Which are you?

[A] Snyder: Night people pay better attention. They respond more quickly. They're loyal. When I worked radio I had a segment from midnight to one A.M., eastern time. It was just you and Tom all alone on the telephone. I was astounded at the callers' grasp of foreign affairs, national affairs, sports, whatever. It was like I was in a postgraduate course and I was learning from them. It was wonderful. Night people are in no hurry. Morning people are. They're on the way to somewhere. They're leaving their homes, getting in their cars, walking, going to airports. They're busy people on missions. Night people are suspended in time. Eventually they go to sleep, but they pick the time. They're in no rush. Their days will end when they decide. That creates a relaxed, melancholy, magical attitude. I'm clearly a night person. I start very slowly in the morning. I was offered a job doing national radio during the day. I turned it down. I like tying up a day, not beginning it. I don't like to point toward what's coming up; I like to look back on what's just happened and whether or not it means anything. When I was a kid in broadcasting, I didn't want to do the six o'clock news, I wanted to do the 11 o'clock news. I wanted to be the last word. I wanted to say, "Folks, that's how the day wraps up."

17.

[Q] Playboy: We know it's a drag when guests don't talk enough. Who talks too much?

[A] Snyder: Politicians never come up for air. They have agendas they want to get in. Usually it's something we've all heard before. After last year's earthquake I ran into a congressman here. I said, "You know, you're talking about Cal Trans fixing all these freeways. It's going to take a year. Why doesn't somebody think about calling in the Army Corps of Engineers? Isn't that what they do--build temporary roads and bridges?" He said, "Gee, that's a great idea. I'll get right on it." He left the building. Two minutes later my producer's cellular phone rang. It was the congressman's PR guy saying that the congressman would be glad to be on my show that night. It told me one thing: He didn't come here to talk about helping people; he came here to get on television. He came here looking for airtime, and that's not what a politician, in my view, should do. So I don't like interviewing politicians.

18.

[Q] Playboy: Does television give people what they want, or do people just want what they get?

[A] Snyder: Both. The idea is to get as many people into the tent as possible. That means television is always programming to the lowest common denominator. Another big problem is that television is obsessed with telling you what's coming up next, so much so that you can hardly enjoy what's on right now. Some years back I was watching the Protopopovs--the ice-skating team from Russia--and they were doing this wonderful program to Ave Maria. Crawling across the bottom of the screen were these words telling me what was coming up next. I didn't care what was coming up next. Television does not trust the attention span of its audience. It's thought that we all have an attention span of ten seconds.

19.

[Q] Playboy: We understand you're a modeltrain buff. Do you ever put on the engineer's hat?

[A] Snyder: I have a representative collection of Lionel standard-gauge trains from the Twenties and Thirties, and I have a fairly extensive collection of Lionel trains produced after 1970, both by General Mills and by Fun Dimensions, and now by Lionel Trains Inc. of Mount Clemens, Michigan. Since 1975 Lionel has reissued many of the great trains of the Fifties: the Santa Fe diesel, the Streamline passenger cars, the New York Central diesel, the great steam engines, the great Pennsylvania GGI Electric. So rather than try to find the originals, I went the easy way. I have some very, very nice trains, and I treasure them. I run them all, I don't hoard them. In terms of layout I have a couple of loops of track and some little buildings and some little mountains. Every now and then I just go to that room, close the door, and really enjoy being with my trains. I can stay there for three, four, five hours at a time. There's always something broken: a bulb, a loose screw, a wire that has to be replaced, a piece of dirty track. Most of the time is spent doing maintenance. But I'm not yet to the point where I put on the engineer's hat. I haven't gone that nuts.

20.

[Q] Playboy: You've always had such an intimate relationship with the camera. What happens when the red light goes on?

[A] Snyder: The camera is the bartender behind the bar. It's you sitting on that couch. It's somebody at the other end of a phone line. It's just one person, and I'm talking to him.

the once and future king of tv night owls explains how to handle guests, why joy is better than fear and the manifest charms of ron popeil